Learn what Wetcanvas! does with your posted content and images

Dear fellow artists, thanks for stopping by to learn about sculpture and art, if you have hit this page no doubt you were looking for information about a popular web site called "WetCanvas!" with it's interactive message board which allows you to post images and comments.

This is a great idea yes, but there are many such sites, many come and go too, but before you register for a WetCanvas! membership, I must warn you of a few things you need to know about this site which I learned the hard way- BEFORE you become involved. If you don't read the cautions and do your own investigative work then by registering for a 'Free" account there you have just given these people perpetual irrevocable license to take YOUR posted words AND your posted IMAGES and use these as they see fit on WetCanvas! as well as ANY and ALL other corporate media they hold. Read on and learn more!

With my experience as a professional sculptor I joined this forum temporarily, I made about 8 or 10 posts and included 8 photos of mine which I had taken, photoshopped and manipulated, and then made them available there to illustrait works in progress. Soon I discovered that the posts are no longer editable after one hour, after a week I decided this was not the forum for me- too many amateurs and the whole site is geared for a multitude of crafts- knitting, sewing, drawing etc, was full of banner ads and a few other things I didnt care for

So I decided to leave and wished to remove my 8 copyrighted photos but was unable to do so, I messaged the moderator and politely requested they be removed and why, a perfectly reasonable request especially since I had only been there a few days and there were only 8 images in about 5 posts, so it wasn't as though I was asking them to remove 458 photos or something!

Well, I received back a quick response to my request, a rather sarcastic one telling me NO, it was against their "policy" and they will NOT remove my photos and that it was too bad- I should have read the user agreement. So I messaged back and said I wanted to know where it SAID they have my ok to use my images on their for-profit web site. THAT was when I read the ENTIRE 227 line deep user agreement, and way down on line 127 it basically said that you by signing up for an account:

8. CONTENT SUBMITTED OR MADE AVAILABLE FOR INCLUSION ON THE SERVICE

with respect to Content you submit or make available for inclusion on publicly-accessible areas of the Service, you grant WetCanvas! the following world-wide, royalty free and non-exclusive license(s), as applicable:

* With respect to Content you submit or make available for inclusion on publicly-accessible areas of the Service, the perpetual, irrevocable license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify, adapt, publicly perform and publicly display such Content on, in connection with, or to advertise or promote, the Service, and/or related sites.

"Publicly-accessible" areas of the Service are those areas of the WetCanvas! network of properties that are intended by WetCanvas! to be available to the general public. By way of example, publicly-accessible areas of the Service would include WetCanvas! Message Boards, reference image library, blogs, etc.

It says right there you are agreeing to give them perpetual (that means forever) and irrevocable ( that means you can never remove) license to use, distribute, reproduce, adapt etc etc your content on that site as well as any other "related" sites they run, totally free of royalties and remuneration.

According to their own contract you sign, "related" sites they can use your content on could be pretty extensive, they are an LLC commercial for-profit corporation who apparantly owns Wetcanvas AND "Art-Agent" and has a "network of properties" per this:

"Original LLC, owner of WetCanvas! and Art-Agent, ...through its network of properties which may be accessed through various mediums or devices now known or hereafter developed (the "Service")

Justifiably incensed I attempted to further dialogue with these people but they refused to respond and then blocked my messages, so I attempted to contact the site OWNER, first thing I found was the site owner's email address and emailed that address, was I surprised when it came back "User unknown"

----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----


----- Transcript of session follows -----
... while talking to wetcanvas.com.:
>>> RCPT To:scottb@wetcanvas.com
<<< 550 5.1.1 scottb@wetcanvas.com... User unknown
550 scottb@wetcanvas.com... User unknown

So I'm wondering now, invalid email address that bounces, admin whose email address and message box are locked up so no one can contact her, an invalid bogus domain name contact which likewise bounces emails and I go hmmm and these people expect advertisers to send them MONEY???? who would send them money when even their phone number is invalid???

Doing a little web investigation into this site I found this Scott Burkett via his web blog and contacted him:

From: scott@xxxx.com

Subject: RE: Email from Blog Visitor

I have no idea what you are referring to. I no longer own that web site (and haven't for some time). I would recommend you contact the new owners.

You can reach her at kerri@wetcanvas.com (to my knowledge).

B. Scott Burkett

E: sburkett@xxxx.com
M: 404.307.4141
Professional Blog: www.scottburkett.com

-----Original Message----- From: @aol.com
Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 2:00 PM
To: sburkett@xxxxx.com
Subject: Email from Blog Visitor

wrote: I want to know why your moderators refuse to remove my 8 copyrighted photos from your wetcanvas forum. I do not want them on your for PROFIT site and have sent complaints to your ISP as well as your domain registrar. My next step on this matter may not be pleasant, if need be I will file documents in small claims court and sue for removal of these images.

THAT was when I discovered he had SOLD this site at a nice profit I imagine- to some new corporation and thus had cashed in on everyone's content and images they unknowingly put there, after all, how many people sign up to post on a message board read a 227 line deep user agreement that starts out like all the others?

So then I tried emailing this "Kerri", no response there and she had HER email/private messaging locked on this site so that users CANT contact her (fine that according to their user agreement she can sell YOUR content and email address but locks HERS up)

So I downloaded their media kit pdf file figuring in there where the money is they would have some valid contacts, that was when I discovered this site not only uses your images and content for their commercial enterprise, but that they DATAMINE their users and content and that this information is available to advertisers. Their user agreement also requires you to use accurate information (now we know WHY- so you get ad spam) and it says they will send you emails and that you will NOT be able to "opt out" of these emails!

So I had an idea, I began contacting ALL of their advertisers, at least a couple were very sympathetic. I also contacted the site's web host and their domain registrar since their domain name registration I also found was BOGUS and the email I sent to the owner of record bounced, the phone # was invalid (123-456-7890)

And so, began a series of emails to WetCanvas! domain registrar, and their responses;

Hello,

Thank you for your patience. I've forwarded the complaint to the
administrator who handles domain compliance to suspend the domain. Have a
great day!

If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to email our award-
winning customer care center, 24 hours a day, at support@domaindiscover.com.
US and Canadian residents can reach us toll-free at 1-877-518-4965;
international customers may call 1-858-560-9437.

Sincerely,

Peter Fernandez
DomainDiscover Customer Care
support@domaindiscover.com
--------------------------
Hello,

Once again thank you for your e-mail and your patience.  A Senior
Administrator has sent an e-mail to the administrative contact on the
account.  If we do not receive a response within a week, we will suspend the
account.  Have a great day.

If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to email our award-
winning customer care center, 24 hours a day, at support@domaindiscover.com.
US and Canadian residents can reach us toll-free at 1-877-518-4965;
international customers may call 1-858-560-9437.

Sincerely,

Danielle
DomainDiscover Customer Care
support@domaindiscover.com
--------------------------

Re: Domain Registration/Transfer (ticket 972508)
Hello,

We still have to wait a couple of more days before we can turn the domain
off. In the mean time, you might want to address the copyright issue with
the company that is hosting the content of the site, they are the ones that
can remove the content that you're disputing right away.

If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to email our award-
winning customer care center, 24 hours a day, at support@domaindiscover.com.
US and Canadian residents can reach us toll-free at 1-877-518-4965;
international customers may call 1-858-560-9437.

Sincerely,

Pablo Velasco
DomainDiscover Customer Care
support@domaindiscover.com

Eventually, at the 11th hour they corrected their registration, darn it I was hoping the whole domain would take a nose dive for a few days and really hammer it home in the wallet that I wasn't playing games, but I DID finally get my images removed after I replaced 2 o ther images that I had only linked to via remote, with a couple of more "interesting" images ;)

So my advice to you is AVOID WetCanvas! or have a lawyer go over their user agreement before you SIGN, because unless you are as resourceful as I am your photos and content are up there forever for this corporation to make money off YOUR hard work. Any sympathy for their expenses running a message board is misplaced- their ad kit shows they charge some advertisers up to $15,000 or more for ad space.